Talk:Spirit Weapon Item List

The page title is "Spirit Weapon Item List." That can kind of imply that it's a list of spirit weapon items--er, I'm sorry, what I meant by "spirit weapon items" here are items that can be spirit weapons/already are (God knows we aren't listing individual players' unique spirit weapons...)--... which it isn't, and that's already at the top of the [Spirit Weapon] page. It's not just that possible misinterpretation (or one of countless other ones) either; the title is very confusing and strange. I'm really not sure how the page title ended up as "Spirit Weapon Item List"... If it was carelessness, I don't see how it could go ignored for any length of time.

Also, for the table... Well, yeah, it's in desperate need of adjustment. I very much dislike having all spirit weapon type scrunched together like how they are considering viewers are often probably seeking information on a specific weapon/gender... Not only was this done, but the table is just a towering line of columns with the only labels being at the top.

It basically requires that you memorize all the identifiers and the columns they apply to, along with fairly minute spatial complications. And even though you could say "well that's not too hard," in an instance where viewability is the entire purpose of the object, I don't think we should expect all of our viewers to memorize such things just to use the table... >.>

Would it be possible to add a "hidden" column for the ID? I'd really like to be able to sort this thing by the relevant number...

No. Having the ID# on the item templates - even though the template namespace is not acutely visible to the public - was what got Nexon's attention in the first place. So even having it hidden is not going to work.

Well, how about using a different number that retains the same order?

Even something different in the same order might look a bit suspicious, what do you need it for anyway?

Probably for as a start to adding ego food stats.

It's still possible to use the leftover UUID's left on the wiki and add on any missing ones. That's been there for quite a while and Nexon doesn't seem to notice/care/havefiguredoutthereallysimplealgorithm.

With everything in the proper order, it'd be much easier to fill in all the diagonals. Can we make it happen?

We could probably whip something up that doesn't break rules, but I wonder if the wiki would be able to sort it that way.

I don't mind if you sort it that way as long as the ID# themselves are nowhere on the wiki.

Remind me again why we can't have the ID# on the wiki?

I vaguely recall something about being an "official" wiki or something, but according to Dealer we're just some "unofficial fansite"...

Officialism has nothing to do with whether or not we're allowed to have copyright material on the wiki (although I do believe the wiki would be considered fair use).

And IIRC, Sabina has called the wiki an official fansite once, so I'm not even sure what the hell the current state of officialism is.

Copyright material? You mean, like all the names, the word-for-word descriptions, the <insert anything else we have that you see in the game>.

I see no reason for things they don't want people to see to suddenly be "off-limits", especially considering it's critical for at least one formula.

Uhm. When you signed up for a Nexon account, you agreed not to unpack their game files. In order to retrieve such content (IDs), you would need to (or other methods, which are just as illicit and term-breaking). So, no, they weren't just 'suddenly' off limits, they were always. Except, who doesn't break a couple rules now and then?

Doesn't stop all the other information we have on the wiki that's ONLY possible to find via the files.

For instance, disabled skills...

What disabled skills?

For instance, the stat bonuses for rank 1 rest. I'm 99% sure the only way to get that information is through the files.

Well then, clearly Nexon doesn't care for such content. I don't know. Ask them, not me.

Which goes back to my original question: Why do WE care if Nexon cares?

Uhm. Whatever legal powers they have over the wiki?

Which would be non-existant?

Non-existent because?

You said yourself we're protected under fair use.

“	although I do believe the wiki would be considered fair use	„

Do I look like a lawyer to you?

Mabinogi World administration wants to maintain a friendly relationship with Nexon. Please drop the subject.

If that's how it is, that's how it is. Thanks for the answer Angevon :)

Now what are we going to do about this list? It needs to be sorted to be "diagonalized"

The old-fashioned way.

Insert the data into every individual item page.

Uh, the old-fashioned way was condensed down into what we have now, and it was clearly missing a ton.

I was asking how we were going to get it sorted.

I don't see how "what it used to have" has to do with "what you're going to add".

...and that's not what this entire thread seems to be about.

I'm saying if we didn't fill the tables for the past several years, it's not going to magically happen if we separate everything into individual items either.

The entire goal of this thread is filling in the blanks. If you have another reasonable way to accomplish that outside of getting the list sorted, I'm all ears.

And adding ID's to every item's data would do something different how..? (Keep in mind we still have no formula or way to derive every item's stat boost by the ID yet)

With them in order, we only need to know 1/8 of all the stats to easily fill in the rest.

How would individual item pages help?

So we're not even allowed to discuss this?

I know the super-pros are working out the pattern for what items grant what stats, but in the meantime... I'm going to continue to add items and stats not listed, therefore making this page even longer 8D Until someone tells me not to oAo;

orz

More accurately, the "super-pros" have no idea what the formula is, don't want to spend the time to compile a giant list to get all the numbers, and hope that someone else will figure it out instead.

So add away!

Even more accurately, the "super-pros", whomever they may be, cannot actually compile the entire list because so many of the items are inedible between the edible ones, leaving giant gaps and making it unpredictable.

When I said "compile", I was including the time to actually get all the numbers. (I'm calling the stat a number for whatever reason)

I see - thank you :3 Good to know I can fill in some blanks while raising my ego :D