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Talk:Poison Attack

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Contents

Thread titleRepliesLast modified
Probability based on CP?011:30, 15 April 2014
Percentage HP lost3203:54, 13 August 2013
Passive "Ability"723:43, 1 November 2012
Monsters Immune to Poison108:32, 15 October 2012
"Attacks deflected with Counterattack will not make the counter-attacker exempt of poison"713:46, 15 June 2012
Usefulness1419:31, 22 April 2012

Probability based on CP?

I seriously doubt that. Full armored skeletons, with ~1.8k CP and all WEAKEST to me, are poisoning me very frequently and I have ~3k CP. I don't have any poison resistance.

Infodude575 (talk)01:45, 15 April 2014

Percentage HP lost

I've tried using a coral snake hitting 1's against the Black Dragon Knight from EP6, since it shows HP in percentages, and found that the damage occurs in 5 'ticks', each tick taking away approximately 10% of the remaining Hp, resulting in a total of about 43-44% total damage. Can anyone confirm my numbers for me?

From only 2 tests of this I got 96>86>78>70>63>56, and 98>88>79>71>64>57.

More data:

  • 80>72>65>58>52
  • 98>88>79>71>64>57 again.

Seems fairly consistent

Oneris (talk)19:37, 2 August 2013

There's a lot of factors on poison damage. Some monsters don't even get hurt for like 10% hp total.

Meru (talk)21:00, 2 August 2013
 

Well, if defense and protection aren't taken into account, what would you consider the ideal baseline creature to take measurements from?

Hang on. I'm gonna go test on my friend.

Oneris (talk)21:36, 2 August 2013
 

Uhh...a character with 0/0 def/prot with high HP (from healer enchants? I dunno. A full set of healer is like what, 120 or so?

まそっぷ ! (talk)21:39, 2 August 2013
 

Okays, from my guildie, of unknown prot/def, I got 338>270>215>172>137>109, which is a difference of 68,55,43,35,28

So yeah, you're correct. In this case, it seems more of a 20% drop every time, for a total of 66% about...

But at least what's consistent is that the chunks taken off are of the same percentage every time...

Oneris (talk)21:57, 2 August 2013
 

More of a side topic but I think Dischord overrides Poison. I recall poisoning an enemy and immediately Dischording but after being Dischord the poison was gone.

鍾国豪-BIassreiter (talk)22:01, 2 August 2013
 

Maybe the dischord ran out after the poison did? Did you see the hp going down in more ticks than usual?

Oneris (talk)22:04, 2 August 2013
 

I'm not really sure protection reduces the damage at all. Poisoning an ancient giant red eyed ornata spider has full effect and damages about 60% of its total hp, and it has about 90% protection as ancient.

Meru (talk)22:06, 2 August 2013
 

But what explains only 10% hp drop for the black dragon knights, and 20% for everything else? If it was def, we'd get irregular numbers. Maybe it's heavy stander or something?

Oneris (talk)22:19, 2 August 2013

Like Meru said, PoisonImmune="80" PoisonDamageRatio1="0.25" (blackdragonknight)

Do you know exactly what each of the poison stats does? I've been wondering for years, but don't own a snake to test it with.

Sozen Cratos Focker (talk)02:13, 13 August 2013
 

o_O?

PoisonImmune = percent immunity to poison. 80% immunity = 20% chance of poisoning.

PoisonDamageRatio1 = poison reduction. 0.25 = 25% of normal damage = 75% damage reduction from poisoning. Invert that.

Aren't there like 2 other hidden stats with poison in their name?

Sozen Cratos Focker (talk)03:14, 13 August 2013

PoisonDamage and PoisonDamageRatio2.

 

Well, do you know what the "PoisonDamage" stat does? Is it the base damage getting reduced by the other party's damageratio1 stat? or something else?

Is the target's Poisonimmune stat the only thing that influences poison success rate when poison is available?

Sozen Cratos Focker (talk)03:41, 13 August 2013
 

No, it's definitely the ability to inflict poisoning. Every race that has a value greater than 0 has the ability to poison (only 77 races have a PoisonDamage value > 0 :O!).

And, as far as I know, yes, other than Poison Immunity set bonus.

 

But if that was the only thing it does, there would be no need for any possible values other than 0 and 1, but there are other nonzero values like 5, 10, 20 and 25, and it doesn't seem random, it looks like it means something.

Sozen Cratos Focker (talk)03:50, 13 August 2013

coughpercentchanceofpoisoningcough

 

..But you just said that the chance of poison is based solely on the target's immune stat.

Sozen Cratos Focker (talk)03:53, 13 August 2013
 
 
 

So, if 10% drop each time for a 40%-ish total drop in hp was only 25% of the max possible damage from poison...92% total damage from PoisonDamageRatio1="1"?

That can't be right....Can you check if there's a base maximum poison reduction? Something like 50%?

Oneris (talk)02:54, 13 August 2013

I might (probably do, seeing as there is nothing with a 1 ratio) have the ratio one the other way around. Do note there's also a Ratio2. No idea what that does, though, but it seems to be 0 for everything.

If ratio1 is actually an inverted ratio... then that seems inefficient as hell.

 

What about wild gray wolf? It seems to be unpoisonable and can't even be attacked by bone dragons petrify breath. The page says the rate of poison is related to cp but that can't be true if I can very easily poison giant lionesses. The page currently only lists 3 immune monsters.

Meru (talk)03:17, 13 August 2013

Alright, then how about those martial arts tourney guys? I can poison them sometimes, but they only take 1 damage from poison most of them. Sorry for the questions.

Meru (talk)03:32, 13 August 2013

Most only take 1 damage??

They nearly all seem to have a Ratio1 of 0, except the animal summons with 0.5. But that means... Ratio1 isn't an inverted ratio...

 

I've seen a 6 and a 5 damage in there sometimes as well on other ones.

Meru (talk)03:46, 13 August 2013
 

Yeah, I'll have to do more research on what those values do, but I can't really without any source of poison. B> poison pots?

 
 
 
 

o.o

Well that clears it up. So, what should we put on the page? That different monsters take different damage seems a bit vague...

Oneris (talk)23:09, 2 August 2013
 

It's already there. Certain monsters may have a resistance to poison, or will be immune altogether.

   Resistance is a percent value and reduces poison damage by that percent.
   Targets that are immune to poison will never become poisoned.
Meru (talk)23:11, 2 August 2013

Except nowhere does it state how much it should damage.

Btw, does the poison bottle's damage differ from the pet's? If not, I'll update that page with the same vagueness as this page, to be consistent

Oneris (talk)23:17, 2 August 2013
 

Some monsters resist more than others, sea trolls take barely any damage from poison at all, and MA tourney monsters take just 1 damage.

Meru (talk)22:30, 2 August 2013
 

Passive "Ability"

How exactly did we establish that poison is an ability? Or that it is even called "Poison Attack"? Poison is a status on a weapon, such as blessing, and sanctification.

Both the name and calling it an ability extend back to the initial edit of the page in 2008 by User:Naiya, who we're unlikely to contact. I suggest we rename the page Poison and distinguish between monsters' poison and lathered poison status?

Pyro - (Talk)19:49, 15 October 2012
 

A monster's poison is essentially their weapon or "barehands" being lathered in poison.

 

And to them its permanent?

Infodude575 (talk)21:45, 15 October 2012
 

Yes. It's similar to Venom Sword.

 

Um, is there a skill called "Poison Attack" in a Pet Cobra's skill window?

Infodude575 (talk)23:29, 1 November 2012

Are you seriously asking or sarcasm? I can't tell.

If serious, no.

 

If I was sarcastic, would I even bother to ask in the first place?

Infodude575 (talk)23:43, 1 November 2012
 
 

Monsters Immune to Poison

Shouldn't we put a list like that somewhere on the page?

Infodude575 (talk)00:59, 15 October 2012

I don't see why not.

Zugon (Talk | contribs)08:32, 15 October 2012
 

"Attacks deflected with Counterattack will not make the counter-attacker exempt of poison"

...really?

Zugon (Talk | contribs)07:35, 15 June 2012

I don't believe this to be true at all. I've countered many poison monsters--using the ice-counter tactic against Ciar Advanced mobs and I have never been poisoned after using counterattack.

SoraHikari07:42, 15 June 2012
 

Same on my part, should we remove it?
EDIT: Went ahead and removed it.

Zugon (Talk | contribs)08:52, 15 June 2012
 

I can confirm that it is true.

Pyro - (Talk)11:11, 15 June 2012
 

I'm yet to see any mob poison through a counterattack... did you see it yourself?
Tested this with a friend, took 3 hits to apply poison, and we did over 20 counterattacks and no poisoning.

Zugon (Talk | contribs)11:45, 15 June 2012
 

I've been fighting a lot of Scathach monsters, and the snakes poisoned me frequently when they made a direct hit on me. But with as many times as I used Counterattack against them, they never poisoned me through it.

--Aramet (Talk)13:05, 15 June 2012
 

this is a first...I never once was poisoned when killing stuff with counter on the hellish beach of Scathach.

S•A•R•I•A13:09, 15 June 2012
 

I have witnessed it myself. I will perform more test.

Pyro - (Talk)13:46, 15 June 2012
 

Usefulness

So just how useful is Poison?

Infodude57514:55, 22 April 2012

Very. The damage done is proportional, visually about 20-40% of hp remaining. On harder bosses and Ancients it can take off several hundred to several thousand hp off a full hp bar. I use it all the time.

Oneris15:00, 22 April 2012
 

It's only useful if whatever you're trying to poison can actually get poisoned, and has either high hp or more than 50% hp left. Poison can't kill, but it does take a percentage out of their current hp (so poisoning something that has only 1/4 of its hp left could be a bit useless depending on the enemy)

Yinato15:01, 22 April 2012
 

What about on Bandits? I mean the Vets and Masters.

Infodude57515:25, 22 April 2012
 

You can poison certain field bosses after some effort. Their HP loss is really useful from the poison and makes them easier to take down.

☽ミ☆カ☆ヤ☾15:25, 22 April 2012
 

I use poison all the time with Master Bandits; e.g I'm taking on 2 bandits while my snake poisons the other two.

SoraHikari16:31, 22 April 2012
 

Also remember that weapons with poison lathered on it isn't as effective as having a snake with Poison attack.

though I'm not quite sure about the venom sword...

☽ミ☆カ☆ヤ☾17:46, 22 April 2012
 

I can see the logic behind poison-lathered weapons and snake venom...

But just how strong is poison-lathered weapon compared to snake venom?

Infodude57517:58, 22 April 2012
 

I know it's less effective...as far as values go, I have no idea.

☽ミ☆カ☆ヤ☾18:25, 22 April 2012
 

Poison is poison (though I have no proof in terms of pet vs pot/bottle), but the fact that you don't have to frequently lace your pet with poison makes using a pet snake more practical. That being said, that snake's ability to poison won't be of use to anyone if it's dead :x Either pray that you poison the target before the poison wears off on your weapon or hope that the target doesn't kill your snake before it gets poisoned.

Yinato18:47, 22 April 2012
 

Out of some 1000 bottles, none of the weapons I have poisoned (Mainly swords...) did not poison after the very few uses it had before the poison wore off from the weapon.. As for the snake, after about 30 feathers, it would finally poison the Giant Long Gnu. :x I could be unlucky...or maybe some had more luck than others. Maybe there's poison resistance?

I dunno...maybe poison is poison, regardless of origin. I find snakes more reliable though.

☽ミ☆カ☆ヤ☾18:58, 22 April 2012
 

The probability of poisoning is based on the cp difference, so you probably (definitely) had higher cp than your snake.

Oneris19:04, 22 April 2012
 

Which goes back to what I was saying earlier about not having to constantly lather your pets in poison (though that would be cool). I tend to train my pets to around lvl 50+, so that accounts for why my snake has a better chance at poisoning whenever I'm on my alts. The venom sword is a more expensive yet effective alternative to snakes and poison lathering, but not everyone has one (anymore).

Edit: forgot to mention that although you technically have unlimited "hits" using a snake (until it either gets killed or runs out of summoning time), poisoned weapons do have 2 huge advantages: you can use them any time (can't summon mr./mrs. Snake while pulling that cart around), and splash/AoE skills like windmill, crash shot, r5+ smash/magnum shot can technically poison everything that gets hit, and it would only count as 1 use. I've tested this out while running sulfur spider. Tl;dr use a snake for 1 opponent, and a combination of a poisoned weapon and an AoE skill (That isn't magic or alch) for multiple enemies.

Yinato19:13, 22 April 2012
 

Well then this raises the Question: Just how useful are Venom Swords?

Infodude57519:14, 22 April 2012
 

Using venom swords comes with the same risks as using regular melee skills. Although the base damage range and crit rate are nice, you'll still have run up to the target (vs using a snake as cannon fodder that can poison). The whole point of the venom sword is to deal decent damage, while at the same time, constantly having a chance to poison whatever it is you pulled the sword on.

Yinato19:31, 22 April 2012