Talk:Mana Shield

Does this skill actually have any benefits to ranking it apart fomr MP/INT? It seems like an epic waste of MP...Novaix 12:30, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

It's just like having more HP, which, in general, seasoned players don't really need. ---Angevon 16:25, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

I understand what the skill does, I mean what benefit is there apart from more MP/INT to RANKING it.Novaix 00:50, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

To the best of my knowledge it uses more mp per hit than hp you would lose at lower ranks. i believe at rF its 200% or more. meaning if a monster does 50 damage to you, you'd lose 100 mp. Ranking it reduces the %--Goldenchikle 13:42, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes, ranking it higher would increase the efficiency. This skill would make healers even harder to kill, from what I can see. Assuming the healer has 300int, and a heal wand equipped, and heal charged, at rank one, they not only have the defense bonus from heal, but 3.85 mana efficiency. I can see how this skill would be useful in other situations, but I know that someones going to make the 'pro's will never need that' excuse, or something of the like, so I won't bother. --FFVIISephy 22:43, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

I agree with everything you said just now. if i was using it that way I'd have the equivalent of well over 800 hp untransformed. and i also agree with how people say "the pros will never sue this". which is technically true since i know plenty of people with more hp than they need and they still don't get hit >.> but i get hit and have lots of mp so I'm SO looking forward to this. thats why i left my last comment to a simple "state the facts" thing.--(not-so)Anonymous 01:15, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

The entire point of "ms" is to take damage you could not take otherwise. This directly brings us the the question where in the world is there a place where we "must" tank disproportionate amounts of damage with Nao, advanced feathers unavailable? The answer becomes the g9+ hardmode shadow dungeons where monsters generally have 2k~4k hp on top of 30~50 prot, effectively neutralizing any chance at a 1HKO even from the much vaunted maxed giant full swing w/ level 40 ego battle hammer. Even in a party of 8 full of the most talented and elite players at the ends of the world, it becomes nearly impossible to come out unscathed by these kind of mobs. This is where "ms" comes in. It allows high level players an option of avoiding death by using their mana instead of their more fragile hp as a bulwark against damage. And there is no way you will not get hit in the shadow realm, the monsters are too strong to be dispatched within a hit and multi aggro is somewhat similar to ciar adv raggo or rat man. The problem is unlike ciar adv, you just don't use windmill in the shadow realm unless you absolutely have to because it generally takes 3~6 windmills to take out a single hostile target <not counting shadow alchemist>. Those who have done ciar advanced know that if it even takes 3 windmill casts to disable a creature, chances are the others will have killed you by then.

Many players wonder why dark knight is so much better than pally <ms> is the reason which at rank 1 combined with 300 int "30~33 mana per 100 damage" allows dark knights <assuming infra> to tank nearly 1000 damage at the very least on their mana alone.

But what's to say a player who is a Paladin doesn't already have at or near 300 INT? That, combined with the Paladin's, assuing Champion, extra 15 defense and 6 protection, and they can have more HP than an Infra, should the infra roll a low HP transformation. As the bonus to mana efficiency caps at 300 INT, there's a threshold to how long the DK can be better than a WK before the WK catches up and they become equal again. --FFVIISephy

Slight error there, Infra will never have less HP than a Champion, given same level and equipment, as the minimum boost of HP for a DK is -Equal- to the boost of a Pally. The main reason why even after 300+ Int (easy with magic and music skills) is that DK also get an MP boost greater or equal to a Pally. At least HP and/or MP would be boosted greater than a Pally. Of course the defense and protection gives the Pally a slight edge with the damage calculation. --DarkWyvern 13:00, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

In most situations a mana hax pot <cash shop mana pot> will render you invincible to anything short of damage along the lines of the 2k range.

Ratio

Wouldn't Rank F mana shield 100 damage cost you 200 mana?Novaix 07:15, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

That would be the value for novice rank; at rank F the ratio becomes 0.8 (100 damage = 125 MP) but that's ignoring the healing wand/int bonus. Rank F with max int bonus is 1:1.65 MP:Damage Ratio, or about 100 damage = 60 MP. --Duet 08:34, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Didn't see that novice was in there, nevermindNovaix 12:05, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Bug?

I just noticed something while dueling. When I activated MS just as the duel started the status turned off and yet the effect kept. I sustained damage but mana wasn't subtracted during the fight. this allowed me to win the entire fight against someone powerful and yet I suffered little to no damage. anyone confirm this? or am I just crazy?-Chaoskirina

hax--Hengsheng120·^TALK_CONTRIBS 14:59, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

It is NOT a hax. probably some rare code bug since I can't seem to get it anymore.-Chaoskirina

Fun Facts about Mana Shield Deactivation

Apparently, one can deactivate mana shield during the middle of attack cycles. I am really enjoying this. I can n+1(+2 with dw) a monster, deactivate mana shield during the slashing animation, then perform windmill so thus, I am not losing 10% hp and 10% mp, and when windmill is finished its animation, it's possible to turn mana shield back on. This really opens windows strategy wise with mana shield, even with dedicated windmillers. It's even more fun to N+1(+2), turn off mana shield, load defense during windmill animation, activate mana shield, then let the monster hit through the defense. --Miyuna 06:06, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Mana Shield + Mana Elixir

I've noticed some people are of the opinion that turning off Mana Shield right before the 1-minute Mana Elixir wears off restores most of the original duration (which didn't make sense to me), so I went out and bought one. Recorded a video, and here are the relevant timestamps:

0:07 - Mana Shield on

0:10 - Mana Elixir used

1:01 - Mana Shield turned off

1:47 - Mana Elixir wears off.

Mana Shield was in use for 51 seconds, which, if I'm right about (time remaining after Mana Shield is turned off) being proportional to (time remaining while still in Mana Shield) (does that sounds confusing?) then the time remaining after turning Mana Shield off would be (60 - 51) * 5 = 45 seconds, which is one off from the test results and probably due to rounding.

I think this might be worth a note if someone else can duplicate it, seeing as how the "Turn off Mana Shield for four more minutes" seems to be pretty common from what I've been reading about the two together. (which has mostly been from reading the Nexon forums, so it might just be my fault...) --Duet 06:42, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Try activating manna shield after using the elixir? --Sozen Cratos Focker 16:07, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Mana shield simply speeds up the timer on the mana elixer by 500%, so for every 1 second you have mana shield on it removes 5 seconds from the normal duration. Aka Using a mana elixir normaly for 4 minutes, then using mana shield will leave you with a mere 12 seconds of elixir. Tellos 17:27, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

Kusina: Male + Female

I was working on getting Mana shield for my elf, while my wife was working on her mana shield for her human at the same time. When it came to the part to party up w/ a member of the opposite gender for Kusina, she and I both talked to her while in a party. My male giant's quest did not continue, while my wife's human's did. My male human had continued the quest w/ a female human. When my wife logged her giant, I was able to continue the quest when in party with a giantess...Maybe Kusina is speciest?Demaetri (Talk) 09:00, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Wouldn't it be called racist? Since Giants are a different race?--Tricky ^B _Bomb (Talk) 09:19, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Well you need to be the leader in the party for it to work so maybe that was the problem. Anyways, congrats on your mana shields lol. --Δκυmσ - ταłκ 14:11, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Speciest, racist...same thing, really? lol...Oh, I don't remember if I was the leader at the time...>.> I guess that would make sense, though. And whoops! It was my giant, not my elf in the original posting >.> Demaetri (Talk) 21:41, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

I believe the point is there is no such word as speciest. Racist means the exact same thingNovaix 00:11, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Regarding the windmill penalty

I only seem to lose 13/310 (4%) MP when untransformed and 38/530 (7%) mana transformed when I use my windmill. I have Rank 9 mana shield and well over 300 int. I can't seem to figure out why its not a consistent percent loss between the two though. Its definately less than 10% as you can see. Has anyone else noticed this happening? Tellos 07:46, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Most likely when you windmill it calculates the hp you would have lost for windmill and then convert it to mp damage as well. So meaning if you lose more hp points during wm (like let's say you lose 50 hp during wm), then it'll be converted to how much mp damage you take and subtract like that. In the same point, if you take 10 hp lost during wm, it'll convert 10 hp lost and convert it to how much damage it would do to your mana pool and deal damage accordingly. It's my personal belief that the number of hp taken from windmill is the one that determines how much mana you lose, not necessarily the %. --Miyuna 14:35, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

You might be right since my HP loss would have been 30 then applied to the efficiency it'd be 30/2.25 which comes out to ~13, same thing for pally. I guess I'll just change that on the mana shield page then Tellos 04:15, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

So does it just deduct 10% of your max hp from hp manna manna, or is the manna part of the penalty Dependant on your manna shield's manna efficiency?--Sozen Cratos Focker 10:12, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, it is 10% of both mana and hp if your mana = hp (i.e. 100 hp and 100 mana), however many people either have more hp or more mp than them being equal. When you windmill, you lose 10% hp. So that 10% hp you loss will be numerical, example if you have 200 hp, you would lose 20 hp, yes? So that means you take 20 hp damage to mp, however if you got 300 int with r1 mana shield, that 20 hp damage will be converted to mana damage, so you will lose like 12 mp? Since with 300 int and r1 mana shield, 20 hp dmg = 12 mp dmg. So whatever numerical value you lose in hp, will be calculated in mp damage, not necessarily 10% mp damage. --Miyuna 07:26, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

That seems kind of strange, i personally only have ~100 int and rF mana shield, and using windmill nets me a 22 hp loss. From the 300 int bonus estimate, its safe to assume that 100 int gives around 0.28 to efficiency, totalling to 1.08 (rF + 100 int bonus). But from using Windmill, instead of losing around 20 mp, i lose 16 (i have 177 max mp). So isnt the mp lost from using windmill be (max mp * 0.1)/effiency instead of hp?

Considering I lose my HP equivalent modified by the Mana shield value, I'd have to say you are wrong and you need to recheck your numbers. ~~~~ Tellos 21:55, 7 November 2010 (PST)

That may be because the 300 int bonus estimate is incorrect, since it's just an estimate. Has anyone even confirmed the 300 int bonus estimate?--§ýkÌ☼ 21:34, 8 November 2010 (PST)

I have confirmed it. I also have evidence to suggest that the int bonus to mana shield is not linear, 200/300 int is not necisarily 2/3 of the .85 bonus. I don't know the exact calculation however. Tellos 09:49, 9 November 2010 (PST)

That makes a whole lot more sense. Thanks for mentioning that the bonus increment rate isnt linear. Not sure about this, but im just assuming its exponential.--§ýkÌ☼ 21:23, 14 November 2010 (PST)

Mana Shield affected by protection and defence?

Does anyone really know if defence and protection affect the damage mana shield takes or is it purely based on the rank of Mana Shield plus INT? (plus healing wand if held) --Bryanneo 15:46, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Considering while training on White Spiders I took 2 damage with a kite shield and heavy armor and all sorts of other stuff, I'd say it indirectly affects due to decreased HP loss. That is, the HP damage that getc converted already has the def/prot factored in.Novaix 22:28, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

To me it seems like only wearing a shield and it's hidden Def/Prot bonuses affect the damage I take but i havent really known if the defence and protection numbers on your character screen affect it. I'll have to test it out sometime. --Bryanneo 13:51, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

The way mana shield works is that damage is not directly calculated into MP at first, instead whatever HP damage you take will THEN be converted to mana damage, so in a way, the Defense skill, defense points, and even protection indirectly affects mana shield. If you take less HP damage thanks to any defensive properties, then that means when it is converted to mana, it'll be less damage. --Miyuna 14:29, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

That's what I just said :S Novaix 23:50, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

As far as I can tell the damage rate is (((Damage - Defence) * (1 - prot))/Mana Efficiency) - Melee Shield Defence Bonus. And yes I have confirmed that melee shield defence bonus comes AFTER all damage calculations including mana shield (Took 13~19 damage with mana shield and no shield, then took 1~4 damage with mana shield and shield). I have not been able to find a person with a 0 point damage range (or close to it) to test if mana shield comes before or after normal defence and protection. However I suspect it does not due to the damage trend with monsters. There would only be a VERY slight variance in damage if it comes before, except in the case of damage > 200 (this assumes you have 35 def and 20% prot like me). Tellos 18:56, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Healing Wand MP usage mod

Anyone know if this affects mana shield? I don't have mana shield yet, so I can't test it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Health (talk • contribs) . Please always sign your comments with the button or by typing ~~~~!

Wiki policy:Wiki pretty much denies the existence of mods and uses them only for research such as durability loss. there are plenty of forums meant for what you're asking.--Sozen Cratos Focker 00:47, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

I think you've entirely misunderstood what he said; he's asking if a Healing Wand modified for -MP Usage% like the Tikka Wood Healing Wand would decrease the MP lost from using Mana Shield. --Duet 00:58, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

And I doubt it does. It lowers MP usage, but from testing with my -24% MP usage ice wand, I haven't really noticed much of a difference. Besides, why would you use mana shield with a wand? Wouldn't you want to conserve your MP? --Link 01:05, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Oh that's what he meant by mod

Link, healing wand equipped raises manna efficiency slightly for manna shield. Maybe getting a -mp usage upgrade increases this effect, but that's not likely, manna loss from manna shield is technically done by the manna shield status and not the skill itself, and it's handled like damage rather than like mp used by a skill. The constant drain from having the skill active might be affected though. --Sozen Cratos Focker 02:03, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Probably mentioned somewhere in this page, but.

I take more damage with mana shield on than without, why is that?

vs rats that do 1 damage w/o mana shield, but 4~7 damage with mana shield.

Rank 6, 876 int, 173 magic attack, 31 def, 4 prot

That certainly sounds strange. I'm not sure if Mana Shield was changed since Enlightenment, so you may have to refer to that thread regarding that. If you saw that thread already, there isn't much to say.

Totes overlooked that thread.

Your defense goes down to 0 (technically) when you use mana shield. It's all based on your magic attack after that in regards to how much it protect you. I don't know the math, but rats do barely any damage so your 31 defense normally is enough to make it 1 dmg. I guess somehow you still don't have the magic attack to make it only 1 dmg also with mana shield on.

Testing with 0 def and 0 prot, I threw a rock at a rat and took 1~2 damage without mana shield on. When I turned it on, I started taking 3~5 damage per hit. This is with over 1000 intelligence. Meanwhile, a friend of mine with low intelligence but with armor on (I didn't ask the exact amount of int or def/prot) took 1~2 damage with mana shield on. Neither of us had any reforges related to mana shield on. This seems to imply that def and prot still apply to mana shield at this point in time though there is definitely a very noticeable nerf in mana shield's efficiency.

Strangely, when I asked a friend to smash me in a 10% duel, I took 40 mana damage but 200 hp damage. Clearly the efficiency is there, but the rat is somehow still doing more damage to me with mana shield on. Perhaps efficiency increases as damage taken in a single hit increases.

I'll continue investigations over the weekends.

Did you take into account your friend's rank of mana shield, if he was equipping a magic weapon, or how much magic attack he had?

He was barehanded, rank 6 mana shield, and since he had low intelligence, he probably had low magic attack as well. I was the same, except with high intelligence/magic attack.

Two words: Defense Protection

The patch notes specifically say that defense and protection are no longer used when calculating damage to mana shield. I can only guess there's a bug where armor mastery or armor still affects the calculation.

In retrospect, it's obvious I would be taking more damage with mana shield on against weaker enemies. For example, the article on white spiders says that they have 5~10 damage. I have 21 defense while naked after this update so I can easily block any damage they do. However, with mana shield on, that defense is nullfied so I won't be able to completely reduce everything to 1 damage since it's impossible to get a 1:10 mp to damage efficiency.

I'm still not sure why my friend was able to take less damage than me with mana shield on though and I really don't want to raise any armor masteries since I don't care for them... perhaps someone else can test?

Red Spider hit me for 10~18s with Rank 6 Mana Shield, 662 Int, and no armor but Royal Knight Boots and Gloves (both 4 Def, 2 Prot), a Tail Cap (1 Def), and a Wedding Ring (1 Def, 1 Prot); left me with 98 Def and 6 Prot (10% Damage Reduction). It hit me for 8~14 with Pumpkin Bat Costume (4 Def and 3 Prot from upgrades), resulting 102 Def and 9 Prot (15% Damage Reduction). It hit me for about 7~10s with Royal Knight Armor (24 Def, 15 Prot, Rank 1 Heavy Armor Mastery) for 142 Def and 31 Prot (35% Damage Reduction), and then 3~5s with Kite Shield (2 Def, Rank 1 Shield Mastery) for 165 Def and 42 Prot (42% Damage Reduction).

I didn't do enough conclusive tests since I ran out of MP so fast, but its quite clear that equipment masteries are doing something...?
No wait. 41 Defense from the equipment masteries would reduce the damage to 1; that would only leave protection.

Seems like Mana Shield only affects Defense and has no bearings on Protection?

What about damage reduction from passive defenses?

I wasn't transed at the time, but I got hit for 1~3s when Heavy Stander ping activated, so I guess its possible.

Just for the record: Damage reduction on Heavy Stander in trans is active even if the hit doesn't activate the ping. The ping from auto-defense on equipment does not reduce damage.

Auto-Defense does reduce damage by 50%. A Snowfield Slayer's slash which does a fixed 100 damage only did 50 when AD activated. I wasn't transformed either.

Hmm... my bad then. I don't use auto-defense stuff all that often, so I guess I should keep my mouth shut.

I thought it was all forms of ping from Heavy Stander that reduces damage by half?

Well, there's also something about shields that just equipping one greatly increases mana shield reduction even if it doesn't ping. I don't have heavy armor mastery ranked, but I do have r1 shield mastery. It turns 10-17 damage with mana shield on to 1-2 damage with mana shield on. I have r6 mana shield, and had 206 magic attack when I tried this on mutant carnivorous plants. No armor or accessories just shield and no shield. I'll have to refresh my memory on how much it helped at black dragon's fire breath, or snowfield slayer's swings.

I heard JP wiki says Mana Shield still factors in Magic Defense? I have 97 Magic Defense, 50 Magic Protection (46% Magic Damage Reduction), 676 Int, and Rank 6 Mana Shield. I didn't run enough tests on this but weak Skeleton Squad explosions do 1 without and 7~ with while strong hits 120~ without and 150~ with. I didn't go unarmored nor did I bring any potions for pot poisoning.

I think it's just hidden shield stats and defense skill with a shield which lower damage from a short test on ice sprites with armor, without armor, with shield, without shield, defense with shield, defense without shield.

Oh yeah, I forgot about hidden shield stats. They're so... hidden.

My test with the Red Spider, Kite Shield has 15 passive defense against melee and I was taking about that much less damage, so that seems quite accurate. Would it be safe to conclude that MS doesn't take hidden shield stats into consideration?

I don't know about passive, but the hidden shield stats makes ice sprite 23 damage melee attacks with mana shield on without shield into 1 damage melee attacks as does using the defense skill with a shield with mana shield on. I take 1 damage without mana shield on from both its melee and magic. The damage was only reduced with shield without defense skill loaded on melee attacks but not for magic attacks.

At Anime Expo this year, Nexon allowed demos of characters with rank 1 Mana Shield (as well as rank 1 Rest, Cooking, Meditation...).

Is this worth mentioning as trivia?

Not really. That's like saying Shakespeare has Rank 1 Mana Shield.

Demos? Like an offline version of the game they set up for people to try?

I'm thinking more like they are on their own private server at Anime Expo.

Nope, it's online. Tarlach server. Yesterday, we ran Ghost of Partholon hard and the full Martial Arts Tournament we the three OP level 51-total characters with hacked skills.

Is anything worth mentioning as trivia?

The fact that it's trivia in the first place means it's trivial...

It doesn't sound worth adding at all though.

I think it's was for exhibition purposes that shouldn't really be worth mentioning. You know, to get new players into the game. Course veterans would experience true end-game and what it is like. Hitting end-game is pretty much farming for perfect stuff...e-e

I'm not certain that it involved mana shield but this is what happened. My friends and I were running Alby HM Adv and I had mana shield on. With mana shield on I drank from a fountain that said it caused wounds but it didn't do anything. I drank from another fountain a few rooms and it said it restored my mana fully but it didnt. My mana shield deactivated and my mana drained at about 5 per second until it reached 0. Now it doesn't matter what I do my mana wont come back. I'm so astounded by this that i uploaded a video of it to youtube.[1]

You have Negative mana. either go to a mana tunnel and recover or afk with meditation.

*after seeing the video* Actually...what may have happened is your MP was suddenly reacting being wounded. Since Mana Shield negates wounds, it probably thought you took damage. So much damage that you amy have gone below the threshold of negative MP...either that or it became bugged by the fountains.

Re-logging doesn't fix it and neither does closing the client and restarting it. I submitted a ticked before I posted the issue here here. I just think it should have people take notice to it so maybe they wont drink from fountains with MS on.

Also Getting myself killed didn't solve the problem.

Not even standing by a mana tunnel? Yeah This is really bad if that is the case.

Tried that and it did nothing. My friend thinks that because I had MS on when i drank the fountain instead of wounding me did did damage to my mp instead and it did like 99999999999 or something. i really hope that's not the case.

Hopefully a Rebirth, Full heal potion, or Mana Exlixer fixes it...try those yet? Or a Nao for that matter? Unless getting killed was part of the Nao thing.

I tried the Mana Elixir and it didn't work. I never thought to use a Full Heal pot even though I have like 30 of them on a pet. It probably would have fixed it too.

It's fixed now it was the negative mp thing. I guess the wound fountain glitched into my mp and made me go wayyyyy into the red. it took 12 demi uses with meditation on and transing like 8 times and my MP started coming back.

...geez so there is no limit to Negative MP.

How'd you fixed?

If you would read you'd see how they fixed it.

So, does anyone know how this will affect Mana Shield? Will MA increment efficiency by +.01 per point? Will it increase the total efficiency by 1% of itself per point? And in what way does this effect maximum efficiency? I'm expecting it to somehow be higher, but if anyone has information, it'd be nice to have here.

I'm not exactly sure but I think it means Magic attack will affect mana shield upon damage taken. I would think magic defense would affect the efficiency, not magic attack.

Of course it means magic attack will affect the mana shield upon damage taken. That's what it says. That means in some way, it will affect the efficiency, the stat which determines how much damage is taken. And did you happen to forget that magic defense from int equals magic attack from int?

It wouldn't affect the efficiency since it's based on the skill's rank o.o. You'll just take more damage than you should. Maybe it'll be like piercing damage or something, not like go through HP, but faster mana consumption. don't question me, I'm not a mage or really big on all of this stuff.

Edit: Ehh I'm thinking backwards...I would think that Mana shield would be weaker than it should be, added to the skill efficiency. Big trouble for low int Mana shield users.

My question was in what way does magic whogivesadamn affect the efficiency. It's obvious that it would be increasing it, but I would like to the rate at which it contributes, seeing as before, int increased efficiency up to a certain amount. If the answer is "it is no longer affected at all" just say that, but Eccleston help me if you say that and don't play KR test yourself. I feel it's important to add this to the wiki as soon as it's required.

Mana shield is being adjusted so it absorbs less.

Therefore it's a nerf. Not a buff.

We don't know if it actually absorbs less, just that it's not directly affected by int anymore but magic damage instead.

So how does Magic Attack influence Mana Shield?

I would think it would take a toll on the MP consumption upon magic attacks...(like lose more mana from magic damage)

That makes no sense at all. It doesn't make you lose more MP if you get hit by a magic attack :|

Going on a limb @@. not much of a mana shield user xD... But maybe efficiency is increased depending on magic attack...

That limb broke then...lol. It means instead of the efficiency directly being affected by int, it's affected by how much magic attack you have. How much, nobody knows yet.

Just going to quickly point out that 20 int = +1 magic attack.

OMG..! -facepalm- i don't even understand how you people are coming up with these weird ideas <.<;.. w/e... like sephy said, we want to know how much magic damage increases the efficiency of MS per point. is it: 1 magic attack = .01 MS efficiency. or is it something like: 1 magic attack = .03 MS efficiency. all i know so far is that if it's .01 per point then even with 999int(49 magic attack) you couldn't reach the +.85 that 300 int used to give.

Magic Attack + Rank Efficiency * .015 = Total efficiency

Where'd you get that equation from? I've been trying to find it for a while myself. Edit: and are you missing brackets in that equation o.0 because as it is right now, mana shield would've been insanely buffed, not nerfed

Guild mate from a long time ago. He capped his mana shield fairly recently and dug up the equation for me. as far as where he got it from, I don't know.

Edit: oh... here you go, with brackets. [Magic Attack + Rank Efficiency] * .015 = Total efficiency

Well, comparing the old mana shield formula to the current one, The current one is really crap (putting it lightly). Assuming that the equation given is correct: Old MS formula at 300 int and r6 would have an efficiency of 2.65, or a 2.65:1 damage to mana ratio, which makes sense seeing as how my character only took 50~150 damage while in trans and with MS on against the g8 boss. Current MS formula with the same int and rank would have an efficieny of...0.252 (.25 to make it easier), or a 1:4 damage to mana ratio. Even at capped int (ignoring enchants that give magic attack) would only give it an efficieny of 0.762.

TL;DR if you want mana shield to behave like how it used to, get 175 magic attack >>;

x.x....I forgot to add the rank twice... oops x.x

Updated formula: ([Magic Attack + Rank Efficiency] * .015) + Rank Efficiency (+ Healing wand Bonus)

Old Formula vs New Formula using rank 6 + healing wand + maximum possible stats:

Old: 1.8 + .85 + .5 = 3.15

New: ([49 + 1.8] * .015) + 1.8 + .5 = 3.062

For the new to exceed the old: ([57 + 1.8] * .015) +1.8 + .5 = 3.182

The math you've shown isn't right >> there should be a multiplication sign in the new one. It should be at 1.152 efficiency then with everything capped + wand

Digging around, I found the Japanese wiki has the same thing. if that's not it then I have no idea @@

The issue with the equation is the last part: +rank efficiency(+wand bonus) it's probabpy supposed to be (wand bonus), not addition, because that would mean equipping a healing wand would effectively double MS's efficiency. Though even if it were to end up being addition, that would mean not only hitting the int cap, but getting an additional 6 magic attack through other means (using your equation), or 99 (assuming my version of the equation).

Too much math x.x

oh. x.x;; wand bonus is inertly +.5

I would just like to say that my mana shield appears to be more efficient at reducing damage than before. I have 500 int.

500 int would make it less efficient...a lot less efficient actually.

Assuming the above formula is correct, which it probably isn't.

I already tested the new blaze formula someone posted, and it was completely wrong.

I don't know which formula you're talking about, but if it's new, then you couldn't have tested it properly. When you say you've "tested" the new formula, do you mean you've used blaze over hundreds of times while attempting to keep variables close together through each seperate trial?

The only variable I need to test for INT/M-Atk purposes is the upper bound (If you don't believe me, I suggest you brush up on your mathematics).

Blaze's upper bound is a fixed amount, meaning that no matter how many trials I do as long as the charge time and knockdown meter are the same, the damage is the same.

My testing showed that the upper bound of blazes damage is unaltered with respect to int, and the only change is that M-Atk from enchants now contributes the equivalent of 20 int.

You're only 1 player with only an average amount of int. Claiming that your MS is more efficient isn't exactly going to disprove the formula. With the old MS, I'd take 20s from crumena's rain of thunder skill. I now have 750ish int and I'm taking 60~80 damage per hit. Add in the fact that a lot of the people in one of the guilds I'm in (mostly mages) are complaining about taking more damage, even if the above formula is wrong, it'd only mean that it's even crappier than what it is now.

And you're one person on a wiki who hasn't done any substantial testing. It seems like I left for a year and people decided things no longer need to be verified.

Regardless of what you say,I'll be conducting tests tomorrow to find the actual formula, so please spare me the arguments.

The current formula according the the Japanese wiki is the one on the page...and it's less efficient than it should be. Int based gave it a higher efficiency than what we have now. Making the skill based on Magic attack drastically weakened efficiency for those with 300 int, or 15 Magic attack. A total of at least 57 Magic attack (1140 Int) would be needed to have higher efficiency than the old Int-based system with the current Magic Attack-based system we have.

Also the formula is accurate as far as I'm concerned. if anyone needs to retranslate/reformulate the forumla, here it is in its raw, untranslated glory straight from the Japanese wiki.

“	ランク毎の基本変換効率+魔法攻撃力(小数点以下含む)*0.015	„
—-Japanese wiki

I'm not understanding how the damage reduction works...

Also, I have +300 Int with Rank N Mana Shield and no Healing Wand. Given the income (damage taken) would be any number, what would be the outcome (damage received)?

rN Mana Shield gives 0.5 mana efficiency (why are you not at least Rank F?) while 300+ int adds a max of 0.85 efficiency.

So the resulting efficiency is 1.35.

The formula would be: Mana Depleted = x/1.35, where x is the damage taken. For Example, if you took 100 damage from an attack normally then your mana depleted would be 74.

So in truth, the formula is Mana Depleted = Damage Taken / Mana Efficiency?

I'm not F because I'm conserving AP for other skills (yes, 4 is a lot in my opinion).